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Do you think the GOP tax plan will help or hurt the nation? Operative word: 'Nation.'

Another outcome -- please share

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1. Patricia Pomerleau CEOExpressSelect Member
     Forum Moderator
     (10/24/2017 2:19:39 PM)
     Message ID #292440

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We pretty much gave up searching The Google and other targeted sources to find a neutral article or summary of the proposed GOP tax plan. What we found came from sources many would claim to be biased or were too long to summarize. We'll leave the searching up to you.

Depending on who or what you read, you'll find the tax plan benefits the rich, the middle class, is fair, is not fair, etc. The old saw is true: 'Where you stand on an issue depends on where you sit.'

So, let's try to have our own objective, fair and balanced discussion. Here are a couple of ground rules and a few seed questions:

  • Whether we like it or not, any tax plan affects the nation, so let's consider the big picture. For example, if a corporation gets a cut, and the cut benefits the nation, can you support corporate tax reductions?

  • Cite your source(s) when you state facts, and make it clear when you're giving an opinion.
To get started:
  • Do you consider yourself rich, poor, or in-between?

  • Do you itemize or take the standard deduction?

  • Are your state and local taxes high enough to affect you, or are they in the 'noise level?'

  • Regardless of the source, federal tax plans generally are about taxing income and/or profits. There are plenty of ways to increase one's net worth without income just as governments at all levels have dreamed up plenty of ways to extract their taxes. Net-net, how would you like to pay your fair share?

  • From what you read and your own analysis, is the GOP on the right track even though change may be painful?

  • Many people feel the current tax code is too complex and offers too many loopholes. Do you see simplicity as plus or pitfall? For example, the GOP plan doubles the standard deduction but reduces or eliminates personal and dependent exemptions.

  • Do you do your own taxes? Software or a No. 2 Eberhard Faber? Or do you pay a pro?

  • What about corporate taxes? The GOP wants to cut the corporate tax rate from 35 to 20 percent with the goal that corporations, their workers, and stockholders all will benefit.

  • Other tax breaks may change as well such as state and local tax deductions. Plus or pitfall?

  • The 'flat tax' comes up with every reform discussion. What do you think about the ultimate tax simplification?

  • Congress hasn't enjoyed a lot of approval lately. Do you trust anyone to come up with a fair tax? Who?

  • Other than time and money, what do we lose by refusing to move forward?

  • Bottom lines: Do you think a GOP-led plan will create promised economic growth? What effect do you think the GOP plan will have on the debt and deficit?

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Message edited by user at 10/24/2017 9:08:56 PM

2. Scott Walker
     (10/25/2017 1:23:39 AM)
     Message ID #292467

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Do you think the GOP tax plan will help or hurt the nation? Operative word is Yes

It nice that Bannon, and Laura Ingraham had a meeting last week in Phoenix; it paid off, congrats and let the force be with Kelli Ward senate effort.
Kelli Ward would help Trump with his the tax plan. Where as SnowFlake would not.

3. Thomas C CEOExpressSelect Member
     (10/25/2017 4:45:42 AM)
     Message ID #292468

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Here we go! This will get ugly in no time.

4. D Robb
     (10/25/2017 8:43:51 AM)
     Message ID #292469

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As I understand the plan it will help me personally. I am 75, retired with no debt. I own my house and car, and pay off my credit cards every month. If they blow up the deficit further I won't be around to pay that off.
That said, I think it will be disastrous for the majority of Americans. We should be raising taxes not cutting them. I like the idea of eliminating deductions and simplifying the tax code, but the result should be to raise revenues.

5. Ray Riley
     (10/25/2017 8:49:09 AM)
     Message ID #292470

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It adds to the debt. Simple economics here and everyone should be on board whether they are Republicans or Democrats.

Don't spend what you don't have.

6. Domenick Aulozzi CEOExpressSelect Member
     (10/25/2017 9:11:02 AM)
     Message ID #292471

This message is in response to Patricia Pomerleau ( message id #292440 )  View All Related Messages

We are very low on the middle income scale. Our total personal tax burden is right about 25% of every dollar we earn.

We have become a government dependent country. If we cannot agree on that we will never agree on anything. If we can agree on that then we can start to discuss what is good or bad about that situation.

Is it really the governments responsibility to provide for the elderly and disadvantaged? Why is it not a personal responsibility that falls on each and every one of us. Why is it the governments responsibility to take care of our families elderly and not our own families responsibility?

Why is it okay that just under 50% of citizens in this country do not contribute to the financial needs of the country? Why doesn't everyone have an equal or at least some level of responsibility?

We can complain that this or that plan raises the deficit so that is not good; or this or that plan hurts the poor or benefits the rich so that is not good. But then we continue year after year to spend more and increase the deficit more; it just makes no sense. It is like shooting ourselves in the foot.

Message edited by user at 10/25/2017 9:13:28 AM

7. Scott Collins
     (10/25/2017 9:17:04 AM)
     Message ID #292472

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Sure - Let's raise taxes because our government has proven to make such good use of the money. We should never let the citizens keep very much of the fruits of their labor. I totally trust politicians to decide how much I should keep and how much I really need for me and my family. Everyone can reach their full potential with more government programs administered by workers on the public payroll with gold-plated pensions. Bigger government is always the best answer.

If you don't have an ear for sarcasm.....get a clue.

8. Douglas Robb CEOExpressSelect Member
     (10/25/2017 9:32:50 AM)
     Message ID #292473

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How is it that a Socialist country like Germany can take such good care of its citizens and still have a vibrant and growing economy? How is it that they can see the hand writing on the wall that with an aging population and less than replacement birth rate, they need immigrants to keep the economy growing?
Well, they long ago broke the code on how much defense spending is enough, and were quite content to spend 2% while we spend 4% GDP. They also have a much wiser population that is willing to trade higher taxes on their wages for security in the form of universal health care, and guaranteed pensions.
They also have a sense of community and concern for all their citizens. Remember John Donne’s “Ask Not for Whom the Bell Tolls”?
The attitude of some on this poll for the plight of the Puerto Ricans says it all. The little hands guy’s motto: “Me first, last and always”.

9. Thomas C CEOExpressSelect Member
     (10/25/2017 10:06:32 AM)
     Message ID #292474

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The deficit for '16-'17 was $667 Billion

30% of tax payers itemize their deductions, most are $100k or greater

By eliminating these three write offs, just for those folks, you can cut the deficit by about 60%, doubling the GNP growth from 2% to 4% will take care of the rest. Don't believe what you read

1. ESI Tax Exclusion from 1954
2. Home mortgage interest
3. State and local income taxes

The ESI exclusion discriminates against anyone buying health insurance with after tax money, and is the single largest write off

Home mortgage discriminates against renters, and favors the wealthy who own more than one property

State and local tax write off allows high tax states to be subsidized by low tax states, who get nothing in return

Equalizing the standard deduction is fair to all, and should be embraced by the socialists as it socializes the tax code.

The child care tax credit is pathetically low

Compliance costs are a ridiculous burden for all.

10. D James
     (10/25/2017 10:45:30 AM)
     Message ID #292475

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It appears to be a very lame non-plan. As it stands 45% of the income receiving public pays no income tax, and the top 20% pay 86% of the taxes. The term “middle class” is a misnomer. Who decides who and what the defining lines are for the classes?Karl Marx? He was after all the person who coined the term. How about across the board tax cuts of 10% as a minimum and be done with it? Unless and until a true overhaul of the tax code takes place with establishment of either a single rate flat tax with generous personal exemptions and simplification of deductions for charity, medical, and investment such as IRA/retirement, or, Constitutional repeal of the 16th Amendment that established income tax and replacement with a national sales tax akin to The Fair Tax ( it’s all smoke and mirrors. Both parties love to control taking your money and using it for pet projects rather than the Constitutional intent.
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